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09 November 2013 @ 06:17 pm
Newbie intro and fic  
Hello. I am Malreve. My online buddies call me "Mrs. Verger" though. I've been a huge fan of this pairing for a long time now. How long? "That's what she said!" :)

Is this community still active? I hope so. I think it would be a shame for people to lose interest in this awesome pairing.

Anything you want to know about me, feel free to message me and ask.

In the meantime, I come bearing fic: http://archiveofourown.org/works/1037267

It is called "Some Kind of Stupid," and of course it is Michael/Ryan pairing. Very work-safe, I'm afraid. Hopefully I will finish something more exciting for us all soon. lol! Because of course love so amazing must be consummated. ;)

-Mrs. Verger
oh dear: TBBT: Leonardtinted_glass on November 10th, 2013 03:40 am (UTC)
Hey, there. Welcome to the community! It's not very active anymore, I'm afraid. Michael/Ryan never was a popular pairing, and with Michael's departure in S7 and the end of the series, this little comm has definitely seen better days.

I'm very glad you've decided to post and share this lovely fic for those who may still be around, however! It's so great to see that there are still fans of this pairing. They're one of my top OTPs of all time, so seeing new fic for them was like Christmas come early tbh. What a great way to think of that scene. :>
malreve_fic: pic#122175847malreve_fic on November 10th, 2013 04:25 am (UTC)
Oh, I'm so glad to see this comment! And I'm super glad that I could bring such joy. I know how good fic can really be a kind of 'high', LOL

And yes, I noticed that other pairings seem more prevalent but I don't get that--the opening is there for Michael/Ryan, they could actually make it happen in the show without making it seem completely random because there is just so much material already there.

They are also one of my all time fav OTPs, and I'm glad you enjoyed my interpretation of that scene. I knew as soon as I saw the deleted scene on Youtube what I thought Ryan would have said. ^^

I've had ideas for other fics (trying to remember them all, lol) that would be around this length, and I'm also working on a multi-chapter one that has gotten super long and detailed... I feel good about it but I've gotten to that point where I have to really push myself to keep on writing. I'm trying not to abandon it; I really like it and I think it would be a great accomplishment if I could finish. And that's because... It's already over 50 pages, and has about 7 chapters. Now see, I hesitate to even say that because I'm afraid now that whoever reads this is going to be like "Hey, where is this awesome thing?" and with enough of that you can want to give up on it just to get away from the nagging, lol. I think we're good though. I actually have that document open right now and am trying to think of how to pick up where I left off.

Anyway, I will hopefully have much more to offer in the future. While I do really like "Some Kind of Stupid" I feel that it isn't half as good as most things I've written recently. So I want to bring some quality to this ship, as well as increase the quantity of fic. :)

So... a very merry early Christmas to you! LOL ^_^

-Mrs. Verger
oh dear: TBBT: Leonardtinted_glass on November 10th, 2013 08:58 am (UTC)
I've never understood why Michael/Ryan is so unpopular in The Office fandom. You're absolutely right about the opening being there, about there being a lot of material within canon for the fans to explore in fanworks. But alas. It's just us precious few who chose to embrace it.

Your interpretation certainly puts a more positive spin on the scene! Wouldn't it have been lovely for Ryan to actually reciprocate Michael's affections? OH, that would have been nice.

Ahh! Well, I'm certainly excited to hear that you're working on a multi-chaptered Michael/Ryan fic. No pressure, though! Work on it whenever you're inspired or have the time. I know how difficult it is to get words to flow when you're just not feeling it. Besides, I've been in this fandom for a long time. Literal years have gone by without fic, so I'm used to not having things Now. I can wait patiently, believe me. ;)
malreve_fic: pic#122175847malreve_fic on November 10th, 2013 07:35 pm (UTC)
Awww, you are so sweet! :) I love that you give me encouragement but no pressure, lol. That is what every writer needs (I am an novelist of original works aside from just loving to write fanfiction).

And as you can see from my interpretation of the character Ryan (and as I think my longer fic will demonstrate in full), he does reciprocate but he lives his life entirely by what others think, and he is one of those people who is extremely homophobic not because he hates gay people but because he is gay (possibly bi, but my gaydar is pretty good and I see all those girls he's with and talks about as a cover-up. Most gay guys who aren't 'out' do have those) and literally has a phobia of people somehow finding out even if he's acting according to stereotypes. He's also very closed off in general and not very in touch with his own identity. Overly sensitive and he knows it so he works hard to be stoic and stereotypically macho, and goes so far as to pretend he is apathetic toward everything. Basically he's on the way extreme 'I'm gay AND emotionally deep and sensitive AND I'm attracted to guys who are also very sweet and sensitive, even if they're weird in other ways... so I'm going to act as 'straight' and uncaring as I can, and talk about hot chics a lot, and hide absolutely everything about myself so that anything that could accidentally give me away never does..."

So yeah, I think he does reciprocate but that he is just so embarrassed because of how loud and proud Michael is about everything, when he can't be the same way, and Michael's awkward behavior and how he sees other people reacting to it reinforces the idea that he shouldn't have feelings for Michael. Basically, one screwed up and insecure young man who has been in some kind of identity crisis all of his life and so keeps on changing personas, picking up and leaving so he can go after 'the next big thing'. Self destructive, can't let himself be happy because he's been told that the things that make him happy are 'wrong'.... Such a deep, complex character really, and it's so funny because what people see as him being 'shallow'--obsessed with materialism and later on going through that 'hipster' phase, are actually the things that show him having deeper issues and being the exact opposite of shallow--or at least the opposite of underdeveloped or two-dimensional, which is typically what people mean when they say 'shallow character'. They use the word in the wrong context.

And this scene on the roof... I see Ryan as having these deep-buried feelings in pretty much every interaction with Michael and desperately trying everything to seem like he can't stand him. Because if he can convince people that he hates Michael, or at least can't bear his company, then they would surely never guess that he actually loves him, right?

And ah, Michael. So simple and sweet and forward with his affections, and with everything else. Once again, people underestimate the depth of his character. There is so much more to be explored there. I see so many things in him, things that I can only adequately express with my stories... at least when I'm running this low on fuel (food, which I keep on getting distracted from). Ha ha! XD But yeah, I could go on and on about Michael Scott too. He is a rare bird indeed. :D

Beautiful couple, I'm so excited to have someone to talk about them with! :) As far as I'm concerned, this fandom is NOT dead, I am going to breathe new life into it as much as I can. Hell, I will go recruiting. I've done that before for fandoms. LOL My persistence on certain things is close to the level of Michael Scott's. Bordering on embarrassing. Ha ha ha!

'Well, if you're doing anything crazy, give me a shout...' ^_^ (yah, I know I'm a huge dork, lol)

-Mrs. Verger

Edited at 2013-11-10 07:37 pm (UTC)
oh dear: TBBT: Leonardtinted_glass on November 10th, 2013 10:54 pm (UTC)
Whenever you need encouragement for Michael/Ryan, ho'boy, I'm your gal.

I appreciate your interpretation of Ryan's character! It's a fresh breeze, since my own interpretation is a lot less forgiving, although with a definite overlap in how we see his drives, the things that motivate him to behave the way he does.

I agree that he's very insecure. And at the beginning of the series, I don't think even he was aware of just how deeply that insecurity ran. He thought he was on track for success. He was going to business school. He was putting in the time. He was studying, committing theories and business models to memory, and he was good at it. He knew he was smart and that his academic achievement reflected in his grades. There's a certain degree of arrogance that grew out of seeing that success, a sense of pride in how much he thought he was going to achieve once he got out of school. He thought he was going to make it big in the world. He thought he was going to be a star. And then he failed. He failed spectacularly.

It sent him into that identity tailspin you spoke of earlier, where he kept changing personas in the hopes of stumbling into one where he could discover some sense of self-worth or a deeper meaning to his existence. Because maybe if he could be someone else --anyone else-- he could find a part of himself that wasn't a failure at everything, at simply being alive.

As to how this all relates to Michael-- *laughs* I think that's where our interpretation differs the most. Which I don't think is bad at all! As I said before, I love your take on Ryan. It's like getting to experience a familiar character from a new perspective, which is so exciting for me personally. But yes, my interpretation of Ryan's view on Michael is a whole lot bleaker and pessimistic, I'm afraid. XD

I read their relationship as being a lot more unbalanced. Michael adores Ryan but Ryan doesn't feel the same. He doesn't love Michael, or lust after him, or even like him most of the time. How I view them, I suppose, is being in an unrequited relationship to one another where there's a lot of love on Michael's side with Ryan giving very little in return. Ryan just thinks of him as being annoying, overwhelming, and he doesn't understand for the life of him why Michael continues to show him so much faith and affection. I think in a lot of ways he resents Michael for being that kind to him when he personally thinks so little of himself. He doesn't believe he deserves to be held in someone else's spotlight, and yet at the same time, when that attention is given to him, he accepts it. He tolerates it. Because aside from Kelly, Michael is the only person who sees something in him, and Ryan is so very desperate to have that validated for him even through his own self-loathing. In other words, he draws on Michael's love because he has none to supply himself. He takes what Michael gives and gives Michael just enough in return to keep the cycle going. I view him as being very selfish, insensitive, and indifferent to Michael's feelings most of the time.

Which isn't to say that I think he's completely heartless. There are times, especially towards the end of the series, where he shows genuine appreciation for the kindness Michael has shown him. I think in his own way that Ryan is fond of Michael, but it's through a very egocentric lens that even he doesn't like to admit exists.

Wow that. Turned into a bit of a novel there. As you can see, I still have a lot of feelings about them HAHAH.

Also, I've written Michael/Ryan myself although I've never published it anywhere outside of a Tumblr RP. It was just a little exercise. :) You can find it here.
malreve_fic: pic#122175847malreve_fic on November 11th, 2013 12:34 am (UTC)
I will read your little story thing in a moment here, I'm just responding to this comment first (so maybe I'll end up replying twice, ha ha).

Pretty much everything you said about Ryan I agree with, actually, it's just that I think the other things are there also. And I can't say that I truly believe he's madly in love with Michael, I just see the possibility for it there and I choose to focus on it. Because there are some people who try to avoid acknowledging something they really don't want to see, and some people are just so GOOD at denial, and Ryan fits that type, so that it's just enough to justify my belief in the pairing. LOL XD

As for my seeing Ryan both in the ways that you and I have mentioned, I believe he fits both descriptions and can do so because he is mentally ill. While I don't yet have my Bachelor's in Psych, I am sooo close (about a year away) and I have studied tons of it, mostly Abnormal Psychology which deals with mental illness. By my (completely unauthorized, lol) diagnosis, Ryan is both BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder) and has either borderline or full-blown NPD (Narcissistic Personality Disorder). And for those who don't know (I have no idea who might read this in the future, lol) it is possible--and is actually usually more common too--for a mentally ill person to have more than one diagnosis. That's called being 'co-morbid'.

(and in my description I focused mostly on his BPD tendencies while you described his Narcissism down to a tee. LOL)

So yeah, while I wouldn't encourage anyone to go around attempting to 'diagnose' anyone who they think acts like Ryan, I can say that if you do a little Google of both of those personality disorders then you will see that he fits much of the criteria listed for both of them. Oh heck, I'll just give a couple of links (they aren't from the official APA website so I can't guarantee that all info is official, but from what I've overviewed it's accurate). BPD: http://www.mentalhealth.com/dis/p20-pe05.html
NPD: http://www.mentalhealth.com/dis/p20-pe07.html

He fits both. It's very sad, but makes him a much more fascinating character study. And people with either disorder have difficulty with relationships, and people with NPD often can't look outside of their own needs long enough to feel anything real and lasting for anyone else--at least that's how it appears. I never go just by a textbook though, I think people are more complicated than that, and that those with NPD for example, do fall in love and can have a lasting, committed relationship, but it will just have continued instability within it that outsiders might not be aware of.

I will go read on your tubmlr now. ^^

(Oh, and thank you for saying you'll be my source of encouragement for this pairing. I just might take advantage of that! ;) )

Edited at 2013-11-11 12:39 am (UTC)
malreve_fic: pic#122175847malreve_fic on November 11th, 2013 12:38 am (UTC)
Gahhhh yes, I just read that! And omg, it was wonderful! Oh you should post it on the comm for everyone to read (people WILL come back!). ^^

I think you had all 3 of them characterized perfectly. How sweet, and heartbreaking. XD